With opposition parties lining up their candidates for the by-election in constituency No 18, Belle Rose-Quatre Bornes, Weekly speaks to Sanjit Teelock, former deputy speaker, for his take on the matter. He shares his views on electoral reform, the political situation and the issues which are likely to trigger a general election.

Last time you spoke to Weekly, Roshi Bhadain had just left the ‘Mouvement Socialiste Militant’ (MSM) and the ‘Parti Mauricien Social Démocrate’ (PMSD) had left the government and gone into the opposition. At the time, you put forward some hypotheses. How many have turned out to be true?

I had mentioned that Bhadain was Xavier Duval’s plan B for future elections in which Xavier wants to put himself forward as prime minister at all costs. I think that plan B has disappeared completely now. The first sign which I found surprising was that Xavier did not fight for Bhadain to sit with him on the opposition front bench.

The speaker did not agree.

Still, if Xavier had gone to court, I doubt that the speaker’s decision would have been maintained. Nowhere in the world is the speaker able to determine who sits where so long as the arrangement is agreeable to all parties. So I think she overstepped her boundaries by refusing. But, surprisingly, Xavier did not insist, so it was a first sign that there was not much solidarity between Bhadain and Xavier. And Bhadain made a lot of promises when he went into the opposition but, aside from a few questions in parliament and a few actions at the grassroots level, overall, he has basically been a flop.

He did ask quite a few embarrassing questions, didn’t he?

Not all that embarrassing and quite a few of them backfired because he was part and parcel of what happened in government and people don’t have that short a memory. As one paper put it, he was trying to get a new virginity. That does not happen overnight. Bhadain is unstable and his resignation has proved that.

Unstable or principled? The resignation of course shows some elements of instability but also that he is prepared to give up all the power and privileges and seek a legitimate mandate from his constituents.

I don’t see much principle involved. His whole case has been about the alignment of the Metro Leger (Metro Express – ed.). It’s a weak excuse. I think he was getting fed up being basically a small player in parliament and is trying through this to revamp his campaign and position. There are no principles here.

Do you agree with the Metro Express that will run on the same level with the rest of traffic in areas that are already congested?

The Metro Express dossier is a very complicated one. For the last 20 years all the parties in parliament have agreed that they want a metro of some sort or the other. The parameters which need to be defined are a track, the impact on communities and conglomerations, on jobs etc. The controversy is that the present government was dead set against the principle in the last election, but now it has become its priority. I am in favour of the project because anything that improves the infrastructure of the country and the transport options in the country long-term is a good thing. That’s speaking simplistically. In the shorter-term, has there been enough study on the financial aspects of it, environmental impact, impact on communities and impact on jobs? In these respects, there have been a lot of shortcomings.

“Whatever the result of the by-election, I don’t think it will provoke a general election; it will be the MedPoint case that will do that.”

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So what’s wrong with Bhadain resigning over those shortcomings?

Because his resignation is not going to affect the project. In the best case scenario, he gets re-elected. So what? The prime minister has rightly said that the opinion of one constituency cannot dictate the priorities of an entire nation.

Even if that constituency is Quatre Bornes?

Yes. Unless we start talking like Bhadain and say that all the intelligent people are in Quatre Bornes and everybody else is stupid.

Since Duval moved into the opposition, some people said that he would not be a good leader of the opposition because he was involved in many decisions government took. What is your view?

I think you are quite right in that analysis. Also, the problem is that he had to follow Paul Bérenger, who is master at being leader of the opposition.

Is Duval doing any less well?

No, but you cannot compare him to Bérenger. Bérenger has a lot of experience and he does not have the kind of baggage that Xavier has, limiting the scope of what Xavier can do. And you cannot forget the history of the parties either. When one PMSD MP says that there will be no corruption with us, people remember the history of the PMSD from the 1970s and so on and the story becomes the pot calling the kettle black.

But isn’t the PMSD trying to draw a distinction between Gaёtan Duval’s PMSD and Xavier Duval’s. Can we really hold the PMSD responsible for what happened so many years ago?

Well, obviously they are not the same as they were in the 1970s and Xavier has done some work in rebuilding the PMSD from where it was then. But then how can you attack the papa-piti deal when you have Xavier, Adrien and possibly Alexandre, Thierry Henry and Ghislaine in the wings?

“If you think that there is no meritocracy in the best loser, at least they have stood in elections and got good scores. I still think that the best loser system has done its duty and can continue to do its duty. This by-election, for example, shows that those who talk about mauricianisme are implicitly doing things to split communities.”

Isn’t there a difference between your son being elected as an MP and you leaving your position as PM to give it to your son?

The problem was that Anerood was not the leader of any party when he was the prime minister.

But wasn’t the electoral campaign about him being prime minister for five years?

Yes, but you cannot say that the population was not aware that this was a possibility. The whole campaign of the Labour Party and the Mouvement Militant Mauricien (MMM) was that Anerood Jugnauth was doing all this just to save his son.

Which is why Lepep kept repeating that Anerood Jugnauth would be prime minister for the whole five years until the population believed them.

Anybody who can reason can see that the Anerood Jugnauth of 2014 was not the same as the Anerood Jugnauth of the 1980s. So, regardless of what people believed at that point, it was clear to the Labour-MMM side at least that Anerood was doing it for the son and he was going to hand over to the son. This was nothing unexpected.

And that’s okay?

In parliamentary systems, it’s okay. If he had handed the primeministership over to Nando Bodha, there would have been none of this controversy. But because he handed over to his son, there is all this controversy and our image worldwide has been tarnished. The problem is that if he went, he would have provoked a by-election and they did not want a by-election under those circumstances obviously.

Are you trying to tell me that just to stay in power, they can do anything? What is guiding their decisions, the needs of the country or staying in power?

Every politician in power is reluctant to give it up. They are not doing anything illegal or immoral to my mind. They followed Singapore where Lee Kwan Yew handed over to his son and stayed in parliament as minister mentor. This is where they got that title from.

We are a Westminster system, one day, we go to Singapore the following day to find a model to suit our interested needs and another day we might follow the example of Zimbabwe! Is this any way to run a country?

This is where electoral reform comes in the picture. If you want to change that, you need electoral reform. And that’s where we have been lacking. As president of the commission on electoral reform, Xavier Duval put emphasis on financing political parties. To my mind, this is the last priority.

 “Bhadain’s resignation is not going to affect the Metro Express project. In the best case scenario, he gets re-elected. So what?”

What are the other priorities?

Boundaries for one. The Boundaries Commission is presently considering the redrawing of boundaries under the constitution. They are supposed to do this every 10 years. I had actually submitted a proposal when I was involved in the Local Government Act. The communities thing is the other bit. The constitution was amended to allow people not to have to declare their community. I am a believer in the best loser system. My parents were actively involved in that when my father was high commissioner in London. The best loser system has kept the peace, whether we like it or not, and we are one of the few countries in the world totally at peace. The best loser system has played a big role in that.

But people don’t want to go and vote as Hindus, General Population, Muslims or whatever…

I beg to disagree.

Aren’t we Mauritian before all else?

The Hindus are probably the ones who get the least out of the best loser system. We must not forget that, on the eve of independence, there were race riots in the country.

The best loser is there because there is no meritocracy when it comes to jobs or any privileges…

That’s a bit cynical.

I think the best loser system is a bit cynical as well.

I am not so sure. If you think that there is no meritocracy in the best loser, at least they have stood in elections and got good scores. I still think that the best loser system has done its duty and can continue to do its duty. This by-election, for example, shows that those who talk about mauricianisme are implicitly doing things to split communities.

Let’s talk bluntly; all parties have fielded candidates from one particular community and one particular caste. Is that what you are talking about?

They haven’t; that’s the point. So far, the Labour and MMM candidates have followed this high caste banner. Resistance ek Alternativ (ReA) have put forward a candidate from a community that is double, compared to the high castes in that constituency. The other one, Parvez Dookhy’s party has put up a Christian candidate, where in fact Christians are the biggest individual community in Quatre Bornes, if you don’t divide the Hindus into castes. As have Les Verts Fraternels. So you know each one is putting a candidate that they feel will mix up the equation including the PMSD which has put up a Vaish candidate and it wouldn’t be surprising if the government followed suit. This election has the possibility of being highly divisive along communal lines. And already there are certain pyromaniacs putting up posters and asking for trouble. If we get it, we won’t be counted amongst the top peaceful countries anymore.

Do you think this by-election will trigger a general election?

I always thought that the MedPoint case was the only thing that could provoke a general election. But I don’t expect it to happen so soon. The writ for the election has not been sent out yet and the government has eight months after the writ has been issued. Whatever the result of the by-election, I don’t think it will provoke a general election; it will be the MedPoint case that will do that. But we will find out which party is the strongest.

What is your guess?

I think the Labour Party and the MMM have been premature in announcing their candidates so early.

What’s wrong with the Labour Party bragging about having Arvin Boolell in no. 18?

Putting Arvin Boolell outside of his constituency, especially when, just a month before, he had said that he did not want to go to No. 18, is unwise. As for Bérenger, he fields Nita Juddoo but says that Vijay Makhan will be the candidate for the general election. Then the question is: If Juddoo is elected, where will she go later if Vijay Makhan comes to Quatre Bornes? But then Bérenger has always had a soft spot for pretty ladies.

Was it the wrong choice?

Yes, given the breakdown of the constituency and that this is a by-election. Why not Ajay Gunness, Pradeep Jeeha or my ex-wife, the president of the Women’s Wing, Sundee Beedassy? Jeeha is the deputy leader of the party, if the MMM wants to be serious about projecting a national image, which they don’t have, then Jeeha is the right choice.

But he is not from the right caste.

It doesn’t matter. This is a by-election, not a general election where you have to balance castes and communities. Now Ajay Gunness is a teacher at St Esprit so he has a legitimate claim to that area, and my ex-wife is president of the Women’s Wing and Beedassy cinema is there, her father and grandfather were both municipal councillors in Quatre Bornes. They had three better candidates than either Vijay Makhan or Nita Juddoo.

Vijay Makhan stood as a candidate there. Would that not have helped?

Let’s be blunt. Hindus are 37% in Quatre Bornes. Eight per cent out of that are high caste, 9% are Ravived and 14% are Vaish.

So where does the myth that this constituency has a high percentage of Baboojee/Maraz come from?

It is not a myth; there is no other constituency in Mauritius where, apart from the Vaish, any other caste/community is in a majority. There are 12% Tamils and this why ReA are putting up a Tamil candidate. They are not stupid. There are more Tamils than high castes in Quatre Bornes. That’s why there is a danger of a communal divide coming up, even by parties supposedly against that kind of divide.

To sum up, ReA made the right choice and the MMM had a better option. What about the Labour Party?

For Labour it was more difficult. To my mind, the ideal candidate, Navin Ramgoolam, would have been ideal under different circumstances. The thing that put him off was the court cases that would have distracted him from the campaign. Rajesh Jeetah too would have been ideal and he lives in Quatre Bornes as well. A brand new candidate, like Brian Glover, would have been better to try. Arvin Boolell is a good candidate but he is a high caste candidate, and not all the high caste votes will go to him and we must not forget that if the MSM put up a candidate, the Hindu social and religious hierarchy are backing the government right now, so this will play against Boolell. And though Bhadain was a little bit maladroit in talking about the Hindu intelligentsia in Quatre Bornes, there is an intelligentsia amongst all the communities there, middle-class and lower middle-class, that meet and group and make decisions together.

If a by-election takes place, do you think that in spite of all the scandals, the government might still win?

You have at the moment Bhadain, a candidate from Labour, MMM, PMSD, Hizbullah, ReA, les Verts, plus the new party of Parvez Dooky, that’s eight. And then there is the government. I mean, you can win this election with 25% of the vote. Is the government worth 25% of the vote? If it cannot even get 25%, then I think it is in big trouble. Yes, there are scandals everywhere but they have the National Intelligence Unit in their hands, religious groups, the MBC. So, they have a fighting chance. 

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