It was a smiling, relaxed and refreshingly open Xavier Duval who spoke to us about the issues making the headlines these days. He is forceful about his beliefs but gentle in presenting them, firm about his ideas but inoffensive if you don’t share them. His candid talk may at times not be politically correct but you will find it hard to disagree with.

¦ Mr. Duval, I’d like to start by asking you about your baby, the Equal Opportunities Act (EOA). When will it see the light of day?

Well, it has because it’s been passed by parliament, a slight amendment that had to be made has been made and now we are waiting for the promulgation and the naming of the persons to sit on the commission. I understand that it will come quickly.

¦ But why has it taken so long?

The problem was naming the persons on the commission. Where you have government or business problems, it always boils down to human problems. So at the end of the day, you have to have the right people on the commission so that it starts on the right footing.

¦ What are the criteria for being on the commission?

It has to be someone who is widely respected and seen as fair by the nation.

¦ What do you actually expect this commission to do? Is it really going to bring equality?

I think it’s going to be a start. We are all equal according to the constitution but in cases of discrimination, the problem is that the judicial process to obtain redress takes too long. If you go to the Supreme Court, you will stay there for 10 years. The EOA seeks to reaffirm, in practical terms, what equality means and what types of equality we can look for and it also it gives you avenues for redress in cases of discrimination.

¦ For redress, you have to prove that there has been discrimination. But often, even before the jobs are advertised, the advertisement is tailor-cut for certain people.

I wouldn’t say so. If you look at the civil service, the recruitment process is done through the Public Service Commission (PSC) which is appointed by the president. No one, especially these days, will argue that the president has been indulgent towards the government in naming people that are at our beck and call. This is not the case and I don’t see anyone interfering in that.

¦ Not even Khamajeet?

(He ignores the question- we let him off) I think it’s a good thing that the PSC is seen to be independent because I am very worried about the civil service.

¦ Can you share your worries with us?

Let me put it this way, the country needs a modern civil service that will take risks, that is aggressive, dynamic and civil servants who are ambitious. The system does not foster all this.

¦ How are you going to change that?

That’s a good question. I know that the Office of Public Sector Governance in the Prime Minister’s Office is being beefed up and given extra functions and duties. The other way is to remove from the ambit of the civil service certain things that are not being done correctly. You can see in the budget a number of areas where strategic partners are going to come in and we will be divesting.

¦ In other words you will privatize.

I am not using that word…

¦ I am using it on your behalf because it is a short word for “strategic partners” and “divesting”…

Yes, but that’s because we are not happy with the way things are going. We are accountable for every penny that we spend and raise from the public. We should be looking at value for money.

¦ With the EOA, are you hoping to see more minorities in the civil service?

To tell you the truth, what is happening is that certain communities no longer apply for jobs in the civil service either because culturally it has become unwelcoming for them or because they think there is a hidden obstacle. I don’t think that is the truth but it is the perception.

¦ Is that why you have accepted the proposals made by the Truth and Justice Commission to have a percentage of minorities sit on the board of parastatals?

The Truth and Justice Commission was appointed by the prime minister. He has always championed their work and rightly so. They have come up with 158 recommendations and some more subsidiary recommendations. Cabinet appointed quite a large committee to look at these recommendations. As chairman, what I have tried to do is pick out 19 recommendations which we think can be applied quickly instead of waiting.

¦ Like affirmative action?

It’s not affirmative action.

¦ Oh sorry, positive discrimination?

(Laughs) It is neither of those big words. What we are saying is that there is ability, talent and expertise in every community of Mauritius. The problem is that people maybe sometimes don’t bother to look around for it. It’s just a restatement that we have faith in every ethnic group and let’s try and make an effort to achieve more representativeness.

¦ But you’re not just saying ‘let’s make an effort’. You’ve actually given a figure.

Not me, the commission did. It’s not mandatory, what it is saying is that we start trying to find talent wherever possible. And we can have that principle for women as well. The debate that we are having for communities in Mauritius is the same as they are having overseas in the UK and the US for gender.

¦ That doesn’t necessarily make it right because when you say 65% maximum and the rest has to come from other communities, aren’t you opening a Pandora’s box?

I don’t think so. The aspect of our multiple communities, which is often perceived as a weakness, is actually a strength. Companies and organizations that have taken the trouble to have every community or a mixture of communities represented have reinforced themselves.

¦ It’s one thing when it happens by accident but quite another when you talk about 35%. It then becomes an ethnic issue.

What we are saying is that some people do not take the trouble to find talent in other communities. It’s to avoid this bigotry that says ‘I will find talent only in my own community’.

¦ The problem is that when we talk about ethnic percentages, we are going back to everybody declaring their ethnic belonging.

Look at the Best Loser System. It has been here for a long time, and as far as I know, we are an example to the rest of the world as far as democracy is concerned.

¦ What you are recommending takes us a step backwards in fact.

I think it’s a shame that some people think that in today’s Mauritius, you can get by by ignoring others’ sensibilities. It’s a shame and bigotry to think that only one community has all the answers to all the problems. That’s not the case I don’t accept it and take exception to it. We must make the effort to be inclusive.

¦ How do you identify the communities?

Don’t ask me. I’m just an intermediary. The Truth and Justice Commission made the proposals after years of study cabinet has approved some of its proposals. Let’s forget about whether it is 65 or 75%. What it is saying is that there shouldn’t be boards and committees appointed by government made up of one community. Of course barring a few cases where for instance, qualified people cannot be found. For example, the Islamic Cultural Centre or where such a recommendation would not really be applicable. The principle is laudable.

¦ Yes, but percentages?

You have to have a quantitative figure so that people just don’t say that one out of 20 is enough. You have to have a balance. It’s a guideline

¦ But this will benefit only the privileged from underprivileged communities. It will not really go to the people it is intended to go to.

I believe that we must start somewhere. It is important also that this becomes a bit of a moral duty. And I’ll say something else, based on my own beliefs: once we have a real mixture in everything, we are going to end up with much stronger institutions. It stands to reason, because we have every culture.

¦ Are you talking only about parastatals? What about the private sector?

The private sector is a different issue. If it happens, it would probably need legislation, because it’s not under our control. Secondly, it is not public money. It would be much harder to apply. When it’s public money it’s different. Everyone is paying taxes.

¦ As a tax-payer and a citizen, what is your reading of the current political situation?

First, the rush to have an alliance is obviously a compliment that the opposition is paying to us. They are showing they are not strong enough and are saying “We need to strengthen ourselves.” Second, they have trapped SAJ.

¦ Do you consider him as an innocent victim?

Not really but he is an unwilling casualty.

¦ Unwilling?

(Laughter) Unwilling or not, he is a casualty. The first casualty. The poor chap cannot say anything anymore.

¦ He cannot speak or he will not speak?

He cannot. He is stuck. The outcome is not to his credit. If it was to his credit, he would have come out and explained. Right now, he doesn’t know what to do. Let’s say that he resigns tomorrow and no alliance comes his way. Then he is lost. If he does not resign, he has put himself in a difficult situation. He is very uncomfortable where he is now. We are back to square one of 2005. He is a loser in this at the moment. I think that the prime minister’s initiative is a brilliant move. He called on him to clarify his position.

¦ But why do you think he is still not saying anything?

I don’t want to speak in his place. You must call him and ask him. (Laughter). But I can say that he is embarrassed.

¦ Are you happy that there is so much happening on the political front that nobody is talking about the economy?

Talking is not an issue for me. We are happy that we have, in the budget itself, foreseen that things might turn out badly. We have provided serious measures, a serious amount of money to deal with any possible side effects. We have a large capital budget of Rs20 billion or more to spend this year. We will fund our exports by having a large marketing budget. As we speak, this week we have the minister of tourism in Berlin and minister Cader Sayed-Hossen in Africa. We are putting our money where our mouth is and we are defending Mauritian exports by opening new markets. We have done that and we have got a large capital budget. We are getting ahead with the business facilitation act.

¦ Talking about business facilitation, how are we doing as far as Foreign Direct Investment (FDI) is concerned?

We are doing our very best in a difficult situation. The Board of Investment (BOI) has been very active – much more active than before. Not only on that, but also to defend our reputation overseas. Our marketing has been very aggressive. I’m very happy about that. The Mauritius Tourism and Promotion Authority (MTPA) are very active, as you can see, and so are the ministries and enterprises in Mauritius. We have to judge everything in the right context. And the context is difficult. For instance, you mentioned the FDI. Who is going to build a hotel today? Even if you give a person land and you talk to him nicely, he still has to find the money. He has to have a bank to back him up. So, it’s difficult, but we are doing our very best to defend our position, particularly in India. We have set the framework and it’s looking good so far. We are doing the best work we can and we are constantly evaluating and taking corrective action.

¦ What is the outlook for us?

There is no doubt that everybody is in difficulty. I’d be lying to you if I said to you that everything is rosy. You have seen China reducing its goals this year, Europe is in crisis and India is having a very difficult time.

¦ And so are we?

What I’m saying is that we are highly dependent on Europe. 60 % of our export goods go to Europe and the UK. If the crisis continues in Europe, it will have an impact on us. Secondly, the weak economies of Europe are bringing down the value of the euro and that is having an impact as well. Both the falling euro and the falling demand have an impact on liquidity. That is why we are saying that the National Resilience Fund and the Crisis Support Mechanism are there for genuine companies that are having transitional, short term problems because of the crisis.

¦ Are you referring to Air Mauritius?

It’s a fair question. The government has been very proactive, even in terms of helping with the marketing, the liquidity and everything else. Now, Air Mauritius is not the only company in difficulty. It would have been an exception if it had made a profit. Almost every airline is having difficulties, for two reasons. A lot of Air Mauritius’ revenue is in euros and payments are in dollars. So, the weaker the euro becomes, the harder the situation gets for Air Mauritius. Secondly, we have the enormous hike in the price of fuel. These two reasons are enough to turn profit into loss. Now, there are other issues that we have to address, like how it’s doing its marketing, how it looks at its human resources etc. It is a company that has great prospects, but obviously it also has issues to look into and that is now in the Prime Minister’s Offi ce. I am sure a solution will be found very soon.

Touria PRAYAG
(l’express iD, Friday 9 March)

Touria PRAYAG